Is anyone else as disgusted by the proposal to make hunting domestic cats legal as I am?
Mark Smith of La Crosse has proposed that hunters in Wisconsin make free-roaming domestic cats an "unprotected species" that could be shot at will by anyone with a small-game license. Smith is convinced that roaming cats are a hazard to wild birds. Whenever I look out my window, I see wild birds flourishing! Birds like Canadian geese are making a mess of parks and golf courses. I don't think these birds need to worry about cats!
As the owner of two cats, I can't imagine these wonderful pets being targeted. While our cats are strictly kept indoors, they will try to sneak our if given the opportunity. If, God forbid, my cats were to escape, I would hope a citizen would take them to a local shelter instead of shooting them!
Many farms allow cats to live outdoors, controlling mice and vermin. Cats are doing more good than harm!
http://www.dontshootthecat.com has links to the actual proposals on cat hunting. Share your thoughts theBubbler pet lovers... what do you think?
i am all for it, and allready have killed some. the cats they are refering to are these wild sickly things that are running around sothern WI like a plage. i count 30 some just on my 5 acres. all wild there mean to. not to mention the illnesses they carry. this is spreading into calves and chicken farms as well. they sneek in there for warmth and in turn get the animals in the steril envoriment sick. they are more of a problem then one might think.
when ytou walk into a woods in sothern WI note the lack of squirs and rabits. hell i havent seen a chipmunk in ages. not to mention the bird they kill.
do a search on this, in new zeland the had a serious problem. domestic cats killed off many rare birds. and are getting close to taking out the kiwi.
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life is like a roller coaster, when your up your up, and when you down your down. and if your lucky you have somone with you to enjoy the ride.
The problem is that there won't be any good way to distinguish actually wild "domestic" cats from escaped pets or cats that are left outside intentionally (like on farms) and even if there was a good way to tell, there will always be idiots who think it's a license to shoot their neighbor's cat.
We tried killing off all our cats before. It was followed swiftly by the Black Plague.
It really depends on the situation. I think if somone has a problem with wild cats on their property, they should have some options for getting rid of them.
If I had some wooded property, the last think I would want is a bunch of nasty cats killing off all the wildlife. These cats aren't fluffy the adorable house cat. They are scrawny and mean.
I agree with Crys, there are plenty of people that would just use this as an excese to kill people's pets, so letting anyone with a small game license kill them isn't a good idea either.
Maybe treat them like pests and hire an exterminator.
It is hard to tell whether a cat is domestic or wild when it's tearing across a year. Most cats don't wear collars. Our cats are microchipped as an extra precaution. I think a more humane solution is to trap the wild cats and turn them over to the proper authorities. A cat hit by a bullet in the leg could suffer endlessly before finally expiring.
Our Finner was a stray, abandoned in a Madison apartment. I shudder to think what may have happened to him had a stranger not reported him to the humane society. Because he vomits, a few of his adoptive families even returned him to the shelter because they couldn't deal with it. Thank God they didn't release him into the wild. Now we have the most dear, sweet cat in our house, vomit and all. He's living proof that even abandoned, misfit cats can find a loving home.
Living in the country, at the end of a dead end road, my property is the drop off point for unwanted litters and cats. The humane society won't pick them up, even if I trap them, so I am left with handling the problem.
We have a cat, which we neutered and declawed, she is a part of our family.
A brother-in-law, who refuses to take care of his cats, now has over 35 roaming his house and property. He decided that we could use more outside cats and dropped 7 off without our knowledge or permission.
Let's face it, someone has to address the problem, unresponsible pet owners just pass the buck. Do I hunt them? NO, but I will not hesitate to shoot one I find in the wild. Cats will kill, just for the thrill, not because they need to eat.
Rex
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Always remember, it took one person to build the ark and an entire team of profesionals to build the Titanic
Cats are a domesticated animal and are not meant to be hunted. Cat owners must be more responsible and city governments must uphold their laws about offenders.
:?: Question - is the issue about too many stray cats OR about someone feeding birds and cat are doing as nature intended, eating bird? :?:
The bird populations are NOT in danger because of stray cats.
"The cat hunting law would be like saying that because humans consumed to much beef, then we should then hunt them."
~RedRaven~
Cat and Bird lover.
Cats are a domesticated animal and are not meant to be hunted. Cat owners must be more responsible and city governments must uphold their laws about offenders.
:?: Question - is the issue about too many stray cats OR about someone feed birds and cat are doing as nature intended, eating bird? :?:
The bird populations are NOT in danger because of stray cats.
"The cat hunting law would be like saying that because humans consumed to much beef, then we should then hunt them."
~RedRaven~
Cat and Bird lover.
i do agree whole heartdly that cat owners are the problem. but the quote about the beef and humans is a joke. come on, we "raise" beef to eat. try compairing humans to the wild bufallo killed years ago. know why they got protected? we over hunted. cats in the wild do nothing but damage. and i will tell you all right now you can telleasly if a cat is wild or tame. if that cat is on my property and has no tags its gone.
as for the bullet in the leg not killing it and it suffering, thats kinda a bleeding heart statment. you could say the same of deer being hunted.
i ask you all this. have you ever seen cats so sick there kittens eyes are the size of ping pong balls? have you tried to pull a wild cat from a barb wire fence? that ones not pretty. if you want pictures of how sick they get ill be happy to post them. my ridge is full of sick half blind cats. and the mother cats will give birth to them and atempt to raise them in the brush piles. i find batch after batch of sick kittens. or neglegted ones. these cats just seem to lack the instinct that a regular one has.
as for the trapping. a cat will go nuts to the point of injury in a trap. ive seen this many times. not only that but trapping requires bait, bait draws just as manny domestics as strays. citys allready pay some locals to trap. it doesnt solve the problem. they must be controlled.
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life is like a roller coaster, when your up your up, and when you down your down. and if your lucky you have somone with you to enjoy the ride.
Should "farrell" cats be designated as an unprotected species, allowing hunters to shoot them?
these cats are no longer domesticated.
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life is like a roller coaster, when your up your up, and when you down your down. and if your lucky you have somone with you to enjoy the ride.
as for the bullet in the leg not killing it and it suffering, thats kinda a bleeding heart statment. you could say the same of deer being hunted.
I would definitely say that about a deer being hunted. Regardless of sport, it's a brutal death. Live trapping and euthanasia is much more humane.
Although most shelters are strapped for cash and staff, I hope new services to attend to feral cats will arise from this issue. It is definitely a problem that needs to be addressed.
"The cat hunting law would be like saying that because humans consumed to much beef, then we should then hunt them."
~RedRaven~
Cat and Bird lover.
I think you can be a cat and bird lover and still believe that "eliminating" these stray cats is a good idea. I think most deer hunters would tell you that they really love deer, but they realize that if the population is not controlled, the species as a whole would suffer.
The argument is very similar for the stray cats. One or two stray cats on a few acres probably wouldn't hurt anything, but 10 or 20 would hurt the other wildlife and the cats would also suffer without anything to hunt.
I really sympathize with Rex and mod_wagon_driver here. What is the real difference between having your property full of stray cats or rats?
If he has kids should he tell them that they're not allowed to go out into their own yard because it is overrun with sick stray cats?
I feel that their is an over abundance of feral cats on the stray. They are indeed killing off our songbirds.
Quote:
This one day I witnessed a stray cat toy a beautiful Male Cardinal to death. This kill was nothing more than a game since after the bird expired the cat just left the bird to go to waste. This just broke my heart, I am a bird watcher...but the local strays keep chasing away my songbirds.
I think there should some process of taking care of this problem. Our shelters are overflowing with cats.
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If you talk to the animals they will talk to you, If you do not talk to them you will not know them. And what you do not know you will fear. What one fears,one destroys. ~Chief Dan George. (1899 - 1981)
Should there be a law stating a limit to how many cats can belong in one household? I think yes.
I say this because a few years ago I was visiting a friend on Washington Island, Door County. A neighbor who was a single OLD woman had a huge houseful of cats. I understand she had a loving heart, but my GOD she owned 43 domesticated and feral. Being that old, living by yourself one can't possible take care of the up-keep of that many cats. They were left to basically be wild and overpopulate a good portion of the island.
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If you talk to the animals they will talk to you, If you do not talk to them you will not know them. And what you do not know you will fear. What one fears,one destroys. ~Chief Dan George. (1899 - 1981)
Andy writes:
I really sympathize with Rex and mod_wagon_driver here. What is the real difference between having your property full of stray cats or rats?
If he has kids should he tell them that they're not allowed to go out into their own yard because it is overrun with sick stray cats?
Andy, I do agree and believe if there is a problem it should be taken care of but some areas do not have this problem. It is sad that they have a problem in there area. Yes maybe hunting them in those problem areas is the answer. I am not against hunting. The way it was protrayed here by some media is there may be hunting season of all stray cats who are eating some little birds and causing mass exstinction. Now as Rex and mod_wagon_driver state the problem - I see a issue which needs a resolve. I went to the DNR site of this hunting proposal and it is worded different than posted by area medias. I did comment with the DNR this morning and now see another side of this story not seen in this area and will keep updating from reports from the DNR.
Thanks for showing another side to this story.
RedRaven
Right, allowing anyone with a small game license, no matter where they are, to kill "stray" cats wouldn't be a good idea. There is far too much ambiguity.
I think this should be handled on a case by case basis. If someone has a problem with strays on their property, then they should contact the DNR. The DNR would decide if there is a problem or not, then either hire someone to get rid of the cats, or allow the owner of the property to do it, depending on the location and circumstances.
I can't believe the media misquoted something to promote their own agenda! :roll:
Do you have a link to the proposal? This was all I could find on the DNR's website:
Quote:
Originally Posted by The DNR [url
http://www.dnr.state.wi.us/org/nrboard/congress/sh/cca/[/url]]
Studies have been done in Wisconsin concerning effects of free roaming feral domestic cats. These studies showed free roaming feral domestic cats killed millions of small mammals, song and game birds. Estimates range from a minimum of 47 million up to 139 million songbirds are killed each year. Free roaming feral domestic cats are not a native species in Wisconsin. The above mentioned cats do however kill native species therefore reducing native species.
At present free roaming feral domestic cats are not defined as a protected or unprotected species. Thus Wisconsin should move to define free roaming feral domestic cats, as any domestic type cat which is not under the owner's direct control, or whose owner has not placed a collar on such cat showing it to be their property. All such defined free roaming feral domestic cats shall be listed as an unprotected species. In so doing Wisconsin would be defining and listing free roaming feral domestic cats.
# 62. Do you favor the DNR take steps to define free roaming feral domestic cats by the previously mentioned definition and list free roaming domestic feral cats as an unprotected species?
This what I found so far, I will add more as I find them.
The most important thing you can do is to attend the DNR Conservation Congress Spring Hearings on April 11th at 7pm. This is an issue that will affect the entire state. Every county in the state holds a meeting at that time.To find out where the meeting for your county is, go to: http://www.dnr.state.wi.us/org/nrboa...h/lo/index.htm
Thank you for your communication concerning the advisory question to classify free roaming feral cats an unprotected species. We have received many e-mails and realize this is an issue of great public interest.
It's important for you to know that the Department of Natural Resources (DNR) is not actively involved in a public examination of the status of feral cats [the free roaming, wild version of domesticated cats] in Wisconsin.
Wisconsin Department of Natural Resources Secretary Scott Hassett notes, "Public debate and examination of conservation issues is always a good thing. That said, I want to make perfectly clear that this question advises the Conservation Congress. DNR did not raise this question and is not promoting it."
The Wisconsin Conservation Congress, a citizen advisory group created by the Legislature, is expected to ask the public whether feral cats should be designated an unprotected wild species as part of an annual advisory questionnaire at statewide hearings on April 11. Unfortunately, some people who have read the list of conservation questions for the April hearings have incorrectly identified the question on feral cats as a DNR-initiated move to authorize shooting cats.
The Conservation Congress is a separate body from the DNR, created to give citizens an avenue for input and discussion on conservation issues.
Domestic animals such as cats and dogs are regulated primarily by municipalities through local ordinances. Wisconsin's state legislature would have to amend state laws before a change in the status of feral cats would be possible. It is this department’s understanding that the Conservation Congress is asking this question to gauge public sentiment on this issue. Public support or non-support of this question is tallied at the April 11 Spring Fish and Wildlife Rules Hearing -- held in all Wisconsin counties at 7 p.m. -- and is advisory only – it is not binding.
Feral cats are known to hunt songbirds and inevitably have an impact on Wisconsin's natural landscape, but scientists do not yet agree on the best course of action to deal with that impact.
Wisconsin DNR is concerned about the impact free-roaming domestic cats have on the natural landscape, but is not convinced that the proposal before the Conservation Congress is an effective means of dealing with those impacts and is concerned that the proposal would create the potential for significant conflicts and problems.
DNR does urge people to take the following steps to minimize the harm domestic cats cause to birds and other wildlife:
· Keep your cat indoors. Many cats live happily inside. If you take them outside use a leash. If you let them roam outside, you could be contributing to destruction of native species.
· If you need an outside cat for vermin control, have them neutered.
· Report feral cats to local animal control officers
· If you have unwanted cats, take them to an animal shelter that accepts them.
The Executive Committee of the Conservation Congress has asked DNR to share this message with people inquiring about the feral cat advisory question:
"The Conservation Congress is an advisory body to the Natural Resources Board, and is comprised of citizens like you. There are 5 delegates from each of the 72 counties throughout Wisconsin."
"All Conservation Congress Advisory questions are listed on the Spring Hearing Questionnaire. The Spring Hearings are a tool used to gain citizen input regarding those questions. All Conservation Congress Advisory questions are just that, advisory questions. The results of the Spring Hearings are forwarded to the Natural Resources Board and Department of Natural Resources for further consideration following the statewide recommendations from the Conservation Congress at its annual meeting."
"Citizens who have concerns regarding this question or other questions on the Spring Hearing Questionnaire are encouraged to attend the Spring Hearings on April 11, 2005 at 7:00 PM located throughout all 72 counties in Wisconsin. A listing of those hearings can be found at dnr.wi.gov/org/nrboard/congress/."
"Individuals attending a Spring Hearing can vote on each question on the questionnaire, and may voice additional concerns regarding natural resource issues of statewide significance in a written resolution. Those written resolutions are also voted upon at the Spring Hearing. Written resolutions that receive a favorable vote at the Spring Hearings are then forwarded to the Rules & Resolutions committee of the Conservation Congress. At the Conservation Congress annual convention in May, resolutions are assigned to a study committee for further consideration. Written resolutions are given the same weight regardless of how many counties have forwarded each resolution."
"To view questions that are will be voted on by the public on April 11th or to learn how to submit your own written resolution please visit dnr.wi.gov/org/nrboard/congress"
We hope this answers your questions regarding this issue. Thanks once again for your interest.
Sincerely,
Tia N. Kropf
Wisconsin Department of Natural Resources
Internet Manager, Bureau of Wildlife Management
101 S. Webster Street
Madison, Wisconsin 53707
(608) 266-2194 tia.kropf@dnr.state.wi.us
Studies have been done in Wisconsin concerning effects of free roaming feral domestic cats. These studies showed free roaming feral domestic cats killed millions of small mammals, song and game birds. Estimates range from a minimum of 47 million up to 139 million songbirds are killed each year. Free roaming feral domestic cats are not a native species in Wisconsin. The above mentioned cats do however kill native species therefore reducing native species.
At present free roaming feral domestic cats are not defined as a protected or unprotected species. Thus Wisconsin should move to define free roaming feral domestic cats, as any domestic type cat which is not under the owner's direct control, or whose owner has not placed a collar on such cat showing it to be their property. All such defined free roaming feral domestic cats shall be listed as an unprotected species. In so doing Wisconsin would be defining and listing free roaming feral domestic cats.
62. Do you favor the DNR take steps to define free roaming feral domestic cats by the previously mentioned definition and list free roaming domestic feral cats as an unprotected species?
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life is like a roller coaster, when your up your up, and when you down your down. and if your lucky you have somone with you to enjoy the ride.
I don't think we'll ever arrive with an answer that will settle this arguement. I don't believe the DNR needs to be involved, goverment intervention has never helped a problem, only made more criminals.
I am against killing just for sport, I deer hunt for myself, not for a trophy. If someone would take these unwanted cats, I would trap them and give them to them, noone will, so I do what I must.
I am reminded of the job I was doing quite a few years ago in Texas. I had been contracted to build block walls at the Animal shelter. The third day on the job, I had to shut down at 10 in the morning. The entire crew was sick. Noone had informed us that this was the morning they euphinized the unwanted animals....160 unwanted cats and dogs. They were put to sleep with shots, 7 of us became sick when they wheeled the carts out with the bodies on it, and they were in plastic bags.
Story aside, point taken, in one small town, that was thier average, PER WEEK of unwanted animals. When they are full, they have to turn down animals...
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Always remember, it took one person to build the ark and an entire team of profesionals to build the Titanic
The Truth about the Conservation Congress Hearings
Every year the Wisconsin Conservation Congress has statewide meetings, in April, to discuss changes to hunting and fishing regulations. There are usually around one hundred (100) questions regarding rules changes for both hunting and fishing. Resolutions are introduced at the County level and voted on. If approved, at the County level, then it goes to a statewide vote. This resolution was approved at last year's hearings in La Crosse County, Wisconsin. Now, Mr. Smith stands alone. What happened to those individuals who voted yes to this last year?
It is possible, that the "cat lovers" could show up in force, and introduce resolutions to drastically change or possibly end all hunting and fishing in Wisconsin. With so many different questions and subjects, why is the press fixating on this single question? Could it be that the media is so far to the left that they do not want anyone to see the truth or could it be all the (PAC) money pouring in from places like California and New York? Are the people of Wisconsin just going to take this on the chin and allow the out-of-staters to dictate our hunting and fishing rules and regulations? Add to this, the fact that there is now pending legislation in Wisconsin to FORCE gun registration, and it is obvious that the Wisconsin hunting heritage is being directly attacked by outside influences.
If you want to ensure hunting and fishing in Wisconsin for the future, you had better attend the hearings at your County level on April 11 and contact you state legislators and let them know that Wisconsin doesn't need any more "gun laws."
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There is no such thing as truth, only perception
I'm not coming down one way or the other on this right now...just want to say that I am MOST IMPRESSED with the intelligence and civility of the conversation in this thread. I hear well-meaning people on all sides and have received a good education on the subject along the way.
Bravo! All of you deserve credit for the intelligence and consideration inherent in your posts. Thank you for your contributions.
Here is a example of very un-healthy activity concerning this issue.
Info from: WEAU-TV Eau Claire, WI
Quote:
Death Threat Claims Against La Crosse Man On Cat Hunting
March 10, 2005
The La Crosse man who's asked the state to allow hunters to kill stray cats says he's been getting death threats.
Mark Smith told La Crosse police he's gotten angry phone calls and messages at work and at home.
Police reports say one call made while Smith was working at the La Crosse Fire Department suggested it should be "open season on firefighters." Another woman told Smith that if the state Legislature approved his request Smith would be hunted down and killed.
Smith has asked the Wisconsin Conservation Congress to vote on his proposal at an April eleventh meeting. That vote would be advisory. The Legislature would have to consider the proposal before cats could be hunted.
Smith has proposed that any cat not under the owner's direct control or wearing a collar should be considered fair game for hunters with small-game licenses.
Bravo! All of you deserve credit for the intelligence and consideration inherent in your posts. Thank you for your contributions.
This may take away from the intelligence of the discussion, but the hilarious irony is worth it!
Thu Mar 10, 2005
BATES TOWNSHIP, Mich. - A man cooking in his kitchen was shot after one of his cats knocked his 9mm handgun onto the floor, discharging the weapon, Michigan State Police said.
Joseph Stanton, 29, of Bates Township in Iron County, was shot in his lower torso around 6 p.m. Tuesday, the state police post in Iron River reported. He was transported to Iron County Community Hospital.
Michelle Sand, a spokeswoman at the Iron River hospital, said Stanton was treated there before being transferred to Marquette General Hospital for further treatment. But Marcie Miller, a representative of the Marquette facility, said there was no record of the hospital receiving a patient by that name.
A telephone message seeking comment was left Wednesday at Stanton's home.
State police said he was cooking at his stove when the cat knocked the loaded gun off the kitchen counter behind him.
I have been reading all the posts and it seems everyone has their good points to make. I am for making FERAL cats unprotected for many of the same already stated reasons. It is also very unfair to characterize hunters as the only persons wanting to destroy feral cats! I have seen MANY cats and dogs dumped off in my area because the owners no longer wanted them . If they can be caught I do my best to get them into an animal shelter for placement. If they have tags we can find the owner or if we recognize the animal as a neighbors we return it or inform them that their pet is at large. NO ONE I know wants to kill any persons pet. However it is impossible to catch every dumped animal and some learn to fend for themselves and then breed more feral animals. They must be delt with. If it was possible to deal with the owners we wouldnt be discussing this.
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